Paging Dr. Jass
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Dr.Jass
Pastor of Muppets
I'm not even gonna ask anything about it. I don't want to know. Please, God, don't let it be for sale reasonably. Don't let it be a 4-speed car. It's right sexy, no doubt... the timing is dreadful, though.
I bought two more Challengers the weekend before last (a '71 and another '74) so I'm a tad overloaded on cars at the moment. I'm also waiting on a firm sale price for a '70 Swinger 340/speed to add to the growing hoard.
I bought two more Challengers the weekend before last (a '71 and another '74) so I'm a tad overloaded on cars at the moment. I'm also waiting on a firm sale price for a '70 Swinger 340/speed to add to the growing hoard.
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restoman
The paint fumes have cleared so I'm
Do tell.
71ChargerRT
Well-known member
71 Challenger ehh?
Dr.Jass
Pastor of Muppets
Yes and no. The '74 is, in my estimation, beyond feasible repair. Not only is it rusty but a small tree fell on it, damaging the roof in the area of the rear window (and breaking the glass). It's a low-option 318/auto car, but it's relatively complete (the console and shifter are gone, as are the valances). The value to me is in the disc brakes (same as '73-'76 A-body big-bolt), the 8-3/4" axle, and virtually every bolt, clip, and fastener that I don't have for my current '74. Remember, I bought my project car as a rolling shell. The rough '74 will be a nice reassemby guide, handing over OE fasteners for virtually everything I need. Once I'm done with it, I have a friend who wants it simply because it's an E-body.
The '71 has been garage-kept for at least 15 years. It has a '74 front clip on it, so I assume it's been hit up front. I've known about this car since 1988 and it's always had the later sheetmetal up front. It's also a 318 car, but this one's a stick. It's 100% complete. Yes, it needs one framerail for sure, but frame rails are fairly easy. That car was driven to its current location, where it'll likely remain for awhile. I arranged fairly long-term storage on both cars during the purchase, much to the relief of all involved. The seller wasn't keen to start digging 'em out, and I don't have a good spot for either at the moment. The seller was keeping the '74 fascia currently on the '71 for his '72 Rallye project car, which didn't faze me since I already have three, plus the one in the junker '74.
One simply doesn't pass on a 4-speed '71 E-body, a '74 parts car and a truckload of Mopar parts because of some relatively-easily-repaired rust. Especially not at the price I paid for the whole show.
Nothing to tell, really. Just your standard 340/4-speed 1970 Swinger. White vinyl top, tail stripe and interior. Manual discs, tach, Rallye wheels, 3.91 Sure Grip. Nothing special. Oh, did I mention the paint code? M3. 1 of 14.
Yes, sir. The great thing is that the parts haul alone was probably worth what I paid for everything, so I can almost consider it a freebie along with the '74.
71ChargerRT
Well-known member
That's a pretty sweet haul!
I'd love to have a '71, not that I can afford one, right now, but its high on my list.
I'd love to have a '71, not that I can afford one, right now, but its high on my list.
Dr.Jass
Pastor of Muppets
Along with the cars, I got:
- A complete 1974 360HP out of a 4-speed Challenger Rallye, missing the accessories, water pump, cap/wires and air cleaner... every other factory-original part is there including the valve covers, exhaust manifolds, motor mounts, bellhousing, flywheel, throwout bearing, and clutch fork
- The complete Rallye instrument cluster from the same car (switch panel, light bar, etc)
- The original master cylinder, prop valve, washer reservoir, overflow bottle, and 3-speed wiper motor/blades/arms from the same car
- The Pistol Grip shifter and handle (no linkage) from the same car
- A 1970 big-block 23-spline E-body 4-speed
- A 1972 400HP dual-snorkel air cleaner
- A complete '73-up E/A-body "big-bolt" disc brake setup
- A 742-casting dropout w/Powr-Lok diff and 2.76 gears
- A 3.55 ring/pinion set for a 489 case (OE)
- A 3.23 ring/pinion for a 741 case (OE)
- Full set of Eagle H-beam 440 connecting rods w/505 stroker pistons (1 damaged piston)
- Pair of nearly-new original Cal Custom B/RB valve covers
- A sub-5,000-mile 318 block
- (2) 1971-only Challenger upper grille/hood latch supports
- A 1970 340 driver's-side valve cover
- A pair of A-body clutch pedals (1975-'76 but work all the way back thru '67)
- A manual steering box
- A vintage (antique?) Sun tachometer--predates the Super Tach
- A pair of 340 J heads, bare
- A pair of new 3,400lb B/E-body Super Stock leaf springs
It pays to keep your ear to the ground. The entire caboodle, cars and all, set me back less than four grand.
Dr.Jass
Pastor of Muppets
Just to clarify: I do not yet own the Swinger 340. That's a completely different deal unrelated to last weekend's bounty and I'm still waiting for a price on it. It will cost dramatically more than the Challengers and parts, but it's also worth dramatically considering its rarity. Its original engine, rear axle, and several other specific original parts are missing, but I've collected most of what's needed to put it together. That Swinger also includes a parts car, which is a rust-free 1971 Swinger.
69.5CUDA
Blah Blah Blah
276 trac lock o.0 tyhat cant be a factory unit can it?..and a 360hp..thats a rare bird in itself..especialy a CAR engine..the 360hp in trucks was more common but still not common by a long shot
you know we gunna need pic's...real curious on the tach and those...cals!!!!!!
you know we gunna need pic's...real curious on the tach and those...cals!!!!!!
Dr.Jass
Pastor of Muppets
Yep. It's not common but the Sure Grip was available with any axle ratio.
Well, the E58 replaced the 340 for '74, so they weren't super rare at the time. Chargers, Road Runner, E-bodies and Dart Sport/Dusters came with 'em. However, it being what I believe may well be a sub-17,000 mile complete engine that's never had the valve-cover bolts turned? That's unheard of. The car was parted out in '81 or '82 after being rolled. The odometer from the same car reads 16699. I believe the speedo needle broke in the accident.
Mind you, this stuff's been sitting in a barn for 40 years. NOS, it ain't.
No problemo. The tach is a metal body with a threaded tube for the wires to which the bracket mounts. I think it may require a sender. I haven't done much in terms of research on it yet. The boxes in the upper-left corner contain a set of upper control arms and the 3.55 ring & pinion. The motor mount/bracket assemblies I just found lying on a shelf. In the upper right, you can see part of the A-body pedal assembly.
The dirt on the valve covers will literally blow off, if not fall off by turning 'em over. They're really a sight to behold in person.
Dr.Jass
Pastor of Muppets
A few more pictures...
This is the 318 block. According to the seller, his father worked at a garbage-truck manufacturer that used 318s for many years. If a sold truck had some kind of failure while still under warranty, rather than mess around they simply replaced the whole engine. Broken exhaust manifold? New engine. Blown head gasket or cracked head? New engine. Defective carb? New engine. Mind you, the warranty period was fairly short due to the nature of garbage trucks (they get the hell hammered out of 'em, stop-and-go). He'd take the replaced "junk" engines once in awhile and go through them to resell. This one's been lying around for decades. It probably has less than 10K on it.
Next to it is the 742-case 2.76 Sure Grip dropout:
$40 worth of Eagle H-beam rods with 505" stroker pistons. One piston's junk and I've no use for the other seven, but the rods I can definitely use. Anyone need a totally bitchin' ashtray? Hit me up!
Near as I can tell, this is a 1972 dual snorkel, probably from a 400 Magnum. Whilst digging around in the barn, I may have seen part of the '74 360 air cleaner, but my investigation was interrupted.
The interruption in my investigation was due to injuring my back rather severely trying to move this 1970 4-speed transmission (from a 383 E-body). That injury put an end to my digging, ruined my two days off, and caused me to miss two more days' work. Four days flat on my back, essentially. The factory shifter mount is still in place, which is nice.
The pistol grip from the rolled '74 Challenger Rallye. The seller's Dad (a great guy, by the way) thought the mechanism needed some sandblasting after sitting in the barn. Unfortunately, he didn't bother to remove the handle, which itself got sandblasted. No biggie, I guess, because it needed rechroming anyhow.
The lens is a detail the reproducers got wrong for a long time. A lot of the repros have lettering that looks like Arial Bold font, rather than these tall, thin characters. Most of the repros have been corrected now.
Speaking of the reproduction Pistol Grips, the first few runs of the E-body handle were stamped incorrectly as well. Check out the size of the "HURST" lettering on this first-run reproduction compared to the original above. The E-body had its own specific lettering unused on any of the other variants. That miscue is why my original '73 handle spent 20 years in Kevin's '71 Charger R/T.
This is the 318 block. According to the seller, his father worked at a garbage-truck manufacturer that used 318s for many years. If a sold truck had some kind of failure while still under warranty, rather than mess around they simply replaced the whole engine. Broken exhaust manifold? New engine. Blown head gasket or cracked head? New engine. Defective carb? New engine. Mind you, the warranty period was fairly short due to the nature of garbage trucks (they get the hell hammered out of 'em, stop-and-go). He'd take the replaced "junk" engines once in awhile and go through them to resell. This one's been lying around for decades. It probably has less than 10K on it.
Next to it is the 742-case 2.76 Sure Grip dropout:
$40 worth of Eagle H-beam rods with 505" stroker pistons. One piston's junk and I've no use for the other seven, but the rods I can definitely use. Anyone need a totally bitchin' ashtray? Hit me up!
Near as I can tell, this is a 1972 dual snorkel, probably from a 400 Magnum. Whilst digging around in the barn, I may have seen part of the '74 360 air cleaner, but my investigation was interrupted.
The interruption in my investigation was due to injuring my back rather severely trying to move this 1970 4-speed transmission (from a 383 E-body). That injury put an end to my digging, ruined my two days off, and caused me to miss two more days' work. Four days flat on my back, essentially. The factory shifter mount is still in place, which is nice.
The pistol grip from the rolled '74 Challenger Rallye. The seller's Dad (a great guy, by the way) thought the mechanism needed some sandblasting after sitting in the barn. Unfortunately, he didn't bother to remove the handle, which itself got sandblasted. No biggie, I guess, because it needed rechroming anyhow.
The lens is a detail the reproducers got wrong for a long time. A lot of the repros have lettering that looks like Arial Bold font, rather than these tall, thin characters. Most of the repros have been corrected now.
Speaking of the reproduction Pistol Grips, the first few runs of the E-body handle were stamped incorrectly as well. Check out the size of the "HURST" lettering on this first-run reproduction compared to the original above. The E-body had its own specific lettering unused on any of the other variants. That miscue is why my original '73 handle spent 20 years in Kevin's '71 Charger R/T.
Dr.Jass
Pastor of Muppets
The '74 parts car. These are pictures from eight years ago, before the tree clobbered it. No, that's not a tow bar, it's the original front bumper and yes, it's still there. If you've read the story about Flying Jerry, you've probably seen these pictures already. This car is legend between Kev and I--he wants it if I get rid of it. 
Dr.Jass
Pastor of Muppets
I finally got a chance to look closely at my recently-purchased automobiles tonight....
...First, let's discuss the '74 parts car for a moment. In the immortal words of Carl Spackler, the tree "got all o' that one." Not necessarily fatal, but significant to say the least.
However, if you look closely at the second photo in my previous response to this thread (the 8-year-old photo) you might notice that underneath the moss and other buildup, the right fender's actually in remarkably good shape: solid dog-leg, no rust at the front, etc. So, in addition to some all-important fasteners and other minutiae, I got a good fender along with a disc brake setup and 8.75" E-body rear axle, right? Yes. But wait--look at this next photo closely:
Notice anything missing? Like, I dunno, an antenna hole? The rear quarter panel is cut, poorly and certainly not by the factory, for an antenna. This was originally a non-radio car. This is literally the only non-antenna '72-up E-body fender I ever recall seeing. Admittedly, I wasn't necessarily looking but it's the kind of thing that normally would jump out at you in a boneyard or at a show. I didn't remember this detail--I may not have noticed--because I was overwhelmed by "what a pile of shit" the first couple of times I saw it. Also possibly laughing about Flying Jerry the last couple of times.
This car ended up costing me $300, which I paid happily. It is a complete car but I'm giving the 318 and A904 back to the seller. He wants it for some reason. It's less clutter and ultimately one less trip to the scrapyard for me.
'Twas a long day and amazing evening, so I will continue with photos and info regarding the '71 tomorrow--if I don't get arrested for grand theft auto in the meantime. It may be the most spectacular deal I've made in the last 20 years--and that's really saying something.
...First, let's discuss the '74 parts car for a moment. In the immortal words of Carl Spackler, the tree "got all o' that one." Not necessarily fatal, but significant to say the least.
However, if you look closely at the second photo in my previous response to this thread (the 8-year-old photo) you might notice that underneath the moss and other buildup, the right fender's actually in remarkably good shape: solid dog-leg, no rust at the front, etc. So, in addition to some all-important fasteners and other minutiae, I got a good fender along with a disc brake setup and 8.75" E-body rear axle, right? Yes. But wait--look at this next photo closely:
Notice anything missing? Like, I dunno, an antenna hole? The rear quarter panel is cut, poorly and certainly not by the factory, for an antenna. This was originally a non-radio car. This is literally the only non-antenna '72-up E-body fender I ever recall seeing. Admittedly, I wasn't necessarily looking but it's the kind of thing that normally would jump out at you in a boneyard or at a show. I didn't remember this detail--I may not have noticed--because I was overwhelmed by "what a pile of shit" the first couple of times I saw it. Also possibly laughing about Flying Jerry the last couple of times.
This car ended up costing me $300, which I paid happily. It is a complete car but I'm giving the 318 and A904 back to the seller. He wants it for some reason. It's less clutter and ultimately one less trip to the scrapyard for me.
'Twas a long day and amazing evening, so I will continue with photos and info regarding the '71 tomorrow--if I don't get arrested for grand theft auto in the meantime. It may be the most spectacular deal I've made in the last 20 years--and that's really saying something.
Dr.Jass
Pastor of Muppets
1971 Challenger "glamour" shots:
For you data-tag lovers, it reads as follows:
M21 R26 V7X 26 EN2
GF7 U B51 C55 G11 H51
GF7 H6X9 000 A27 Gxxxxx
E44 D13 JH23 G1B 1xxxxx
If'n you can't be bothered to decode, it's a 318/3-speed manual with AC, power brakes, tinted glass, and AM w/stereo cassette (!). It was originally dark green with a black painted pinstripe and black interior and no vinyl top.
The car hasn't moved in at least 15 years. As far as we can tell, it's been stored since 1990, possibly a year or two more.
For you data-tag lovers, it reads as follows:
M21 R26 V7X 26 EN2
GF7 U B51 C55 G11 H51
GF7 H6X9 000 A27 Gxxxxx
E44 D13 JH23 G1B 1xxxxx
If'n you can't be bothered to decode, it's a 318/3-speed manual with AC, power brakes, tinted glass, and AM w/stereo cassette (!). It was originally dark green with a black painted pinstripe and black interior and no vinyl top.
The car hasn't moved in at least 15 years. As far as we can tell, it's been stored since 1990, possibly a year or two more.
thrashingcows
Drowning deep in my sea of loathing...so I'm
What an oddly optioned car! Was there any known history of the car? 71 Challengers are one of my all time favorite E-bodies. My dream E-body would be a 71 Challenger, 340/4spd, buckets, no console, Shaker Hood, side scoops and stripes, preferably in TX9 with a burnt orange interior with hounds tooth seat inserts.
When I bought the Coronet it had a set of NOS-ish 69 front fenders they had filled the rectangular side light openings and put in the round 68's. I say NOS-ish since they were not fresh units but they were definetly NOS when put on since they still had the OEM part numbers stenciled inside the fenders. But the passenger fender was not stamped for the radio antenna either.
When I bought the Coronet it had a set of NOS-ish 69 front fenders they had filled the rectangular side light openings and put in the round 68's. I say NOS-ish since they were not fresh units but they were definetly NOS when put on since they still had the OEM part numbers stenciled inside the fenders. But the passenger fender was not stamped for the radio antenna either.
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Dr.Jass
Pastor of Muppets
It is a rather strange combination. It gets weirder, though.
I know the car was for sale about 20 miles south of here around the time I had my first car. Kev told me aboot it but I never went to look at it, nor do I remember anything about price. In fact, I don't even remember it being for sale, I thought he'd just seen it. He tells me it was for sale back then. Of course, I had a 340/4-speed car, so who cared about one with a 318?
The fella who had it went by "Jerry" but for clarity between he and Flying Jerry, I'll use his actual first name, Ed. Neither Kev nor I is sure if Ed bought the car in '88 not, but after Kev's finding it, it vanished. The first time I saw the car was in 2009 or '09, sitting exactly where it is now. I only knew it was the same car because Ed told me it had a '74 front clip on it. How many 318 stick '71 Challengers with '74 clips could possibly be running around this small town? We think Ed bought it in '88 and had it squirrelled away in his barn, moving it to the new shop after it was completed. How else would it have flown under the radar for 20 years? Ed passed away last year, and I got word that his wife and son were ready to start clearing out a lot of his hoard. His son gave me a price on the car. I asked if he was sure several times, and he assured me it was a "parts car" because it had a bad frame rail. I wrote the checkque and got the title.
I'd love to know more history, simply due to what's been done to this car. Yeah, it's a weird one going by the data tag, but it's like a gift that just keeps giving. We were sure the front end got replaced because of an accident, yet last night I could find absolutely no evidence of crash damage. The '74 from which the parts came was an E5 Rallye Red 360HP car, which I discovered by the door and its date decal (JH23L4Bxxxxxx). The radiator from that car is in this one, but the '71-only hood-latch support is also still in place. Additionally, it sure looks like it's got its original AC condenser:
Yes, the condenser may have been changed, but to see the data tag I had to move the AC hose to the condenser out of the way. In doing so, I broke the little clamp that held it to the inner fender. While we're on the subject of the air conditioning, said option is 100% intact under the hood. The only thing amiss is (now) the clamp I broke. Seriously, every single component is in place:
At the rate AC stuff got tossed back in the 1970s and '80s, it seems surprising that it would've been so meticulously repaired/reinstalled by someone unconcerned enough to use the wrong-year front sheetmetal. Literally everything forward of the quarter panels is from the 1974 360 car. Also curious: At some point, the car lost its AC dash pad and factory steering wheel, yet the AC controls are still in place, as is the '71 gauge cluster:
About half an hour later, I found a factory 1971 base steering wheel in the trunk:
I said "a" instead of "the" factory '71 wheel because I thought maybe Ed had bought this to replace what's in the car... but I had to remove one of those cheesy '70s perforated steering-wheel covers with the lace wrap (visible in the photo) to see the condition of the wheel. Nobody would've bought or sold it with that cover on it, at least in my mind. It might be the factory wheel; I don't know. I also found a data tag for a Butterscotch '71 in the trunk, along with a Butterscotch driver's-side sport mirror and a rather nice flip-top fuel cap and bezel. I took a picture of those, but I must've accidentally deleted it.
Another part that transferred from the red '74? This nearly-perfect Rallye hood, factory-drilled for pins and engine emblems. This is one of the cleanest originals I've seen in the wild. I think it's better than the one on my '73 was back in 1988! Notice that it's actually bolted to what I assume are the original F7-green hinges, though.
More to come... stay tuned.